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Boy tough crowd!…good thing I have a great cheering section outside of the interwebs :p
My mentor seems to like my flash just fine & being that I am a super fresh apprentice I don’t have any ink on skin to post just yet. I get that my art (paintings) may not transfer to skin & that my style isn’t everyone’s cup of tea. I’m sure I’ll get my fill of lame ass cliche tattoos soon enough haha! I came here for CONSTRUCTIVE criticism, not personal opinion on wether you like zombies or not.
That’s ok though, I feel my skin getting thicker by the second :)
Sorry I posted in the wrong forum. Sue me, I’m NEW. I thought this was supposed to be a place where newbies weren’t made to feel inadequate. I’m learning and determined, THAT’S what matters to me.
Now, back to my still life drawing class, cause you know, versatility is something I’m working towards. -
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Tough crowd??? :?
First things first.
@Miss May B. Bananas wrote:
Decent enough to have gotten me an apprenticeship :)
Wrong choice of words, sorry to say.
But this industry is, frankly, full of people who think too highly of themselves. A key thing, and ask any tattoo artists (not tattooist, there’s a difference) the key is; to be humble in the trade. And not let it get to you.
Yes you have gotten yourself an apprenticeship…. So did I…. First day, tattooed on practise skin. Second time on myself, third time on another person. Forth time, portrait on practise skin….Now you asked for constructive criticism? Well I will give you something then. And its my own fault. :( I should have been more…. vivid, in my explanation in my previous post. :D
Your paintings, zombie thingy’s… Well you know what your doing with a brush, colour wise and the gradient. Are you going for any kind of realism? Or just these cartoony paintings?
(Imho the reason why I’m not a fan of zombies, is when they are turned into cartoons. I’m for realism, but that’s me)Your drawings, they are just lined. Yes, that’s how you make a stencil. But you have to think about it, as a tattoo your doing. If you use a machine like a pencil, or brush for that matter, you will rip the skin clean of. ;)
Attending an art class is great. Everybody should, atleast once a year attend an artclass. Kuddos on that. :mrgreen:
BUT I would bet you almost anything, that the teacher NEVER had a tattoo shop. So there is only so much you can learn. Skills is a good thing to have, and an even better thing to expand. But an art teacher, cant teach you how to ink. They can teach you amazing things, that just not work on a live canvas.Your flash IS decent…. Not new, not spectacular, not anything that’s not seen before. Remember there are a ton of tattooist who just follows flash. Copying what’s been done for ages and ages.
Your flash IS okey…. And it can be transferred to skin, I can even imagine that. But again, its all been done before. Do something out of the box.Your art, paintings… They are not tattoos. Now, I’m not saying that they cant be transferred to skin. Just remember one thing, paint and ink are NOT the same medium.
Last thing, friends and relatives are easy to impress. Impress a stranger, and you have made it. ;)
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Comments like “Hmmm…… Your flash is okey. The zombie things…. Lets just say, there is something for everyone.” Aren’t exactly constructive.
I was not discounting your advice, Infamous…perhaps my sense of humor didn’t translate well *shrugs*I realize tattooing is a whole other medium from painting and that my style isn’t for everyone. Versatility is something every artist should strive for. & believing I can achieve what I work towards, shouldn’t be mistaken for the need to eat a slice of humble pie. I know that I can always improve & diversify my portfolio…hence the art classes and passion to learn. Becoming a great tattoo artist doesn’t happen overnight, right? Everyone starts somewhere, right? At least I’m not scratching in my kitchen & am putting forth a solid effort to learn properly under the supervision of a mentor.
Constructive criticism is giving the person a base to build off of. “Okey” is not even proper English, let alone constructive in any way…but that’s just my humble opinion. -
I do believe I gave you the reason why I’m not a fan of them. But advice…. Expand out… Do something, show something you wouldnt normally do.
At least I’m not scratching in my kitchen
Nor am I………. But you just ticked off plenty of members with that sentence.
@Miss May B. Bananas wrote:
“Okey” is not even proper English.
And????
“English” is not even proper Danish :ugeek: Its called Engelsk, now you know two Danish words, okey? -
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Miss May…. Serious now….
You quit already??? Deleting the link. Deleting the topic name…. Why???
85% of the members here had to prove they wanted to do tattoos. Many members even got “STOP TATTOOING!” as an answer. What did they do??? Learned to do better, to up their game……As you said, you are getting used to getting kicked as a novice. Your not showing that.
Now you can do what you like, its free after all. You are free to stay, and if you post anything, you will get a response. Even though there are different views on what people like, and not like. You will get an honest oppinion. Sometimes its okey to say, this looks like crap. Hell, I have done stuff that looks like crap. And could only see it, once it was pointed out. Friends and family couldnt see it looked like crap, cause they didnt know what to look for.
There are tons of info here, and theres a bundle of different people, from all over the world. Different countries has different takes on things.Now sorry for any spelling you might find, as you may have noticed, English isent my first language…. Derfor beklager jeg.
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People need to chill out. If my pc wasn’t broken I’d hand out warning. Nicole you ask for criticism and you get angry when its given. You can react how you want but really take it with a grain of salt. As for you saying you aren’t flowing with ego you should read your posts and your page. Saying you’re decent enough to be an apprentice and such isn’t humble. Saying you’re super awesome isn’t humble etc. You don’t see me going off on how I run my own sho have had two apprenticeships and have done tattoos on local celebs or that I have contacts in some of the biggest companies in the industry. Before anyon tries to turn that around I was making an example not gloating.
Now we aren’t being rude or trying to insult you we’ree trying to help. Now we’ve been on this forum and in the industry for years so you really should take what we say and soak it up. We aren’t going to tell you you’re good and have nowhere to improve. You can’t grow that way. You need flaws pointed out to grow and rectify said flaws. Now family and friends are NOT artists. So they can’t see certain intricacies within a piece of art like a fellow artist. Eat a whole humble pie and try again.
Now as far as the jab chill out. I realize I could have used more tact and I apologize. I didn’t mean to seem like I was putting you down I was just simply stating it was was in the wrong place and it was moved to the proper location.
Now for how people spell. You need to chill out. There are people on this forum from all over the world: europe asia south america canada etc. So be mindful of that before you insult someone. Not everyone here has English as their first language. Lenn is also a very close friend of mine and a fantastic portrait artist and know a lot about anatomy. You could learn a lot from him.
As a closing remark everyone play nice. I don’t want people being rushed off this forum nor do I want to see arguements.
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Point well taken. I by no means think I’m the best and truly am humbled by how much I still have to learn. I’m really excited about learning to tattoo & am sorry if that came off egotistical. My sense of humor gets taken the wrong way in type sometimes.
I do value the opinions of experienced artist and choose to believe that when my mentor tells me I’m doing a good job, he’s being honest.
I’ll play nice from now on ;) -
Don’t let what people say get you down though. It is true you should branch out. It’s not really so you appease other people’s stuff, but if people only see zombies, and such they will think you cant do anything else. You need to show people what you’re capable of. Try to be professional. The “Zomg im awesomesauce” is fine in PERSON, but when you’re online and trying to gain potential clients you need to really show how professional you are. There is a big difference between BEING humble, and feeling HUMBLED. You need to BE humble. Which I’m sure you’ll do from now on.
We arent here to fight you, or discourage you. We are here to help you learn, and grow. Take what we say with a grain of salt because we don’t all have tact. Try not to focus so much on how the message is being delivered, but more on the message that is being delivered. That way you wont take things and get offended rather absorb it, and learn from it. Also, try to avoid offensive flash. I noticed one flash says “fuck” twice in it. 60% of people who get tattooed are female, and 40% of that are around the age 18. You need to try to impress them. When I first had my apprenticeship I had to draw a lot of flowers, and a lot of silly cliche scrips, “Live, Laugh, Love.” That’s because it appeals to the demographic that is more than likely going to get tattooed, and not just walk into the shop.
There is more to tattooing than just slinging ink. You need to be able to do many things. You need to understand statistics, marketing, accounting demographics, science, engineering, art, history, psychology, and above all health standards. The psychology comes in when you listen to very deep, and heartfelt stories while tattooing. Demographics comes in by letting you know which people are getting tattooed, and what their getting tattooed so you can draw up examples that will better suite them to bring their money int he door. Marketing and advertisement comes in when trying to get your name, and style out there. Youll need the help of posters, business cards, social network sites, websites, and more. Accounting comes into play when managing your inventory, and money properly. Science to understand how the machine functions. Engineering to understand why it functions the way it does, and how to make it do things a certain way. Art, and history are pretty closely linked. You not only should know the history of tattoo, but also art history. This will help you a lot. Exposing yourself to the different styles, and paintings, and such over time will really inspire you. Statistics comes into play by knowing which people getting tattooed, when they get tattooed, what times you should make specials, and what times you should advertise more. itll also help with the health issues by knowing the chances of thigns being transmitted, and how to stop them. As well as statics of shops succeeding or failing so you dont make the same mistakes. Medical aspect is the most important. You need to be as clean, or more clean, than a doctors office or dentist. Don’t just do what your state requires. do MORE. This will show your clients your commitment to safety, and the industry. I am not required to wear glasses or a mask, but I do. Clients like to see it, and it also protects my mucousal membranes from microscopic splash back of the machine. I also cover my machines, clip cords, bottles, table, basically ANYTHING I think should be covered. I’ve been told I am a neat freak, or work too hard, but I think I work just hard enough.
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Why Nicole you removed your pictures? I was curious to see also, what is going on here.. It’s very important in this business to stay persistent even with up’s and down’s, and emotional problems what occur sometimes and you just “quit” your passion is not a good sign, you need to work better on attitude, because you must consider this is very highly professional area of art, and attitude how you want to learn this, is very very important.
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@Miss May B. Bananas wrote:
Boy tough crowd!…good thing I have a great cheering section outside of the interwebs :p
I’m sure I’ll get my fill of lame ass cliche tattoos soon enough haha! I came here for CONSTRUCTIVE criticism, not personal opinion on wether you like zombies or not.After watching this go on for a bit, as not only an artist with 10 years under my belt but a current shop owner I felt I had to say something. Why bother being on this forum if I just stay quiet.
The above quote…All I can honestly say is WOW! You are fresh as an apprentice and already with just that one statement you have dissed 70% of the people that may come to you for their choice of ink. This is the attitude that I hate to see in this industry, and the sad thing is that I see it over and over and over. I like to call it more mouth than talent syndrome. Now don’t get me wrong, I get a little “oh okay then” when someone comes in and wants yet another cute butterfly, “kick ass tribal” or Cherries, but not once do I ever ever think in my mind the word “LAME”. Nor do I allow that kind of thinking in my shop. The guys I have now have only had to be reminded a few times that the “lame” designs that so many so-called artists dread to do, are sometimes the difference in being able to do the things that take cash that you WANT to do and the things you HAVE to do.
If you have a great cheering section then I am honestly sorry to hear that. I say that because if everyone around you is just constantly patting you on the back telling you how great you are, you start to think how great you are, and forget that you are no where near as great as you see yourself in your mind’s eye. Harsh? Probably. I am not known for sugar coating anything in any regards to life or this profession. But I see it as if there is no one around to remind you that PEOPLE are the backbone to this industry and as our followers and customers deserve nothing less than our respect for whatever they allow us to permanently place onto their bodies then you’ll continue to do the same bad attitude holier than tho’ crap that has persisted for so long in this field. IMO THAT is what gives this industry a bad name, not the kitchen magicians, or johnny handpicker down the road. Hell I’d have to say that at least 30% of our business comes from fixing or covering up the trash that some friend of a friend who dated a girl who’s best friends brother started inking out of mommies kitchen. Yeah 30%. So those local scratchers that people bitch about I love em’. They help me pay the bills every month.
If all you love is zombie art and the like then do it, but give the other 95% of people that get tattooed some respect and respect their choice of what they want to put on their bodies and maybe, somewhere in the back of your head, when you start on actual people, remember to be thankful that they see you as an artist and have given you their trust to permanently mark their bodies with your art and style and design. Maybe you can keep them coming back, talking to people about how professional and cool you are, which is the very best advertising ANY artist can ever hope for. -
Haha!Oh I’m not quiting! This IS what I want to do and I’m dedicating as much time as possible to learning all I can about the industry, it’s history and its future. Thanx for the advice & forgiving my initial attitude faux pas.
I tried posting some photos but they seem to be too large (they are just photos taken on my IPhone) so as soon as I figure out how to convert them I’ll get posting.
PS where would be the appropriate forum to post the link to my artist page? -
I’m glad everybody has had there say in this.. I think we’re past it now.
I think it would be fine to post your link here? Tattoos go in the “Show off your work” section and everything else goes in the “Original Flash” section and its really just a matter of keeping the forum nice and organized so new people know where to look for stuff.
And as far as those images go, most of us use image hosting sites such as our own facebook, imageshack, or tinypic and post the link here. Personally I use imageshack, or my facebook. Please do not use photobucket though because for some reason the pics from there always look really small. The better resolution photo the better we can help you.
Now, as far as actually critiquing what I have seen of your work (beyond telling you to try broadening your horizons) I do like your linework and you’ve got a solid foundation to build on. For your zombies the best thing I could tell you is to look at if the body were decomposing, what do you think it would actually look like. Be realistic, basically. An eyeball isn’t just going to explode out of a socket but it might go dead and have a hazy cast to it. A body isn’t going to have an exposed rib-cage and still be at all functional. I’m not trying to be mean here, just honest. Just a basic knowledge of the decomposition of the human body would greatly help your art, it could be the difference between average and phenomenal. Also, your colors are pretty monotone, I’d like to see some variation that would bring a degree of depth to your work.
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Thanx for the tips. I’m actually looking at taking an anatomical drawing class next summer or fall depending when it’s available at the local art college. I’m interested in attempting a more realistic style in the future but also like the idea that art doesn’t always have to be realistic & can be left up to the imagination :)
I have been getting a lot of requests for lettering/script in the more difficult spots to tattoo such as fingers & feet. I don’t want to take on more than my current abilities can handle, are there any tips or tricks to working on these areas or am better to leave them to when I’m more experienced?(Sorry should prob be posting this in a different forum)
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The tips on those areas should go to the client, hands and feet fade a lot because they are in constant motion. It’s practically impossible for the tattoo not to get bumped or scraped on something in the healing period.
You should go about tattooing it the same way you would go about tattooing anywhere else, just make sure to get it good and dark. The darker it is originally, the more likely it is to go without needing to be redone (It will undoubtedly fade, but a fade from a dark black to a slightly less dark black isn’t too bad). I’d use something like Intenze Zuper Black for it.
Let your clients know that aftercare is even more important when it comes to hand and feet tattoos
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Apprentices should not do feet or hands until they have been inking in skin for at least 3-6 months really. Way too easy to jack up in that area and then (for any decent shop that is ) it is now the shops responsibility to fix the jacked up ink. Time is money, and time spent giving out free ink to fix a mistake is time away from potentially money walking in.
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